Fatima

[Nevermore]

I've read my Bible reasonably often and I don't recall anyone but God or an angel He sent being allowed to make a heaven to earth phone call, so to speak. Humans either die and stay in their eternal abodes or else they are raised from the dead. Prophets, meanwhile, are living humans and none of them have been children at the time of their official prophetic office. IIRC Jeremiah was notably young for a prophet, and Samuel received a singular message for Eli but no literal children I can recall have been prophets.

Mary is dead and has been for several millenia. Her ability to influence anything here is essentially nill.

 

[NKBJ]

* To have an understanding of the content of the three messages and the current status of fulfillment on the prophetic portions.
It does appear that prophetic content concerning Russia is in play.

* To have an understanding of the motivations behind the censorship of content that has been imposed.
Gaining some ground on understanding this one. It's starting to look as though decades later the upper reaches on the hierarchy realized that they'd been fingered so they wanted to avoid attention.

* To gain some understanding of the conflicting factions involved within the Vatican hierarchy.
The infiltration and subversion are becoming obvious.

* To examine the concept of there being three interlocking city states that have been exacting control over the world, The City of London, the Vatican and Washington DC, determine the validity of the claims and how the censorship plays into it.
Still cloudy with a chance of meatballs on this one; thinking about the infiltration and subversion of hierarchies (Vatican and Washington DC).

* To have sufficient information, to weigh the evidence and satisfy myself as to what the agency involved in producing the miracle of Fatima really was.
L.A.Marzulli and others have dug a pretty deep hole on this one, building upon the work of others in previous decades. In some ways a lot of opinions boil down to if it waddles like a UFO and quacks like a UFO then it must necessarily be _(fill in the blank)_.

 

[NKBJ]

I've read my Bible reasonably often and I don't recall anyone but God or an angel He sent being allowed to make a heaven to earth phone call, so to speak. Humans either die and stay in their eternal abodes or else they are raised from the dead. Prophets, meanwhile, are living humans and none of them have been children at the time of their official prophetic office. IIRC Jeremiah was notably young for a prophet, and Samuel received a singular message for Eli but no literal children I can recall have been prophets.

Mary is dead and has been for several millenia. Her ability to influence anything here is essentially nill.

Just on a side note, actually people are sometimes allowed to come do things to affect the here and now, especially concerning loved ones. I don't know the mechanics of it, don't see it explained in scripture but it just is. To me that doesn't mean what the two sisters and their brother saw wasn't a deception or that it was the queen of heaven or some guy from the year 2525 taking bored immortals on a time safari to see the brutals. There's not a lot there to hang my hat on (yet). But I'm working on it.

 

[NKBJ]

Some of what Marzulli has had to say from his research in the Fatima records.
Fun stuff to scratch your head over.

 

[gregr]

The mother of Jesus, Mary, is dead. Praying to her is fruitless. The Bible teaches to pray to God the Father, in the Name of Jesus, the Son. Satan uses many fake "christian" rituals to suck the undiscerning into his traps. The Bible says there is but ONE Name under heaven by which we must be saved. THAT Name is Jesus. Mary was greatly favored by God, in that He blessed her to be the mother of the Messiah, but that is where it ends. She died, she is dead. Only Jesus was killed and His Blood shed for the remission of our sins. Only Jesus sits at the right Hand of God, as our intercessor, and is poised to return to first rapture up His Church, His bride, then to later, come to Jerusalem to establish His millennial Kingdom. Understand the Truth of Scripture, and don`t fall prey to Satan and his demons.

 

[gregr]

1) Perhaps they are not "delusions".
2) Which superstitions?
3) There are plenty of pale Israeli, Lebanese, Turkish, Syrian, Jordanian women. I don't get your racist implication.

RACIST. lol. lol. lol. lol.

 

[gregr]

Complete skeptic on this one!

Mary picked 3 kids to carry messages?

The “Miracle of the sun” just sounds crazy! Probably mass hysteria.

More likely it was a alien that talked to the children.

Mary couldn`t pick anything she is dead...

 

[gregr]

Just on a side note, actually people are sometimes allowed to come do things to affect the here and now, especially concerning loved ones. I don't know the mechanics of it, don't see it explained in scripture but it just is. To me that doesn't mean what the two sisters and their brother saw wasn't a deception or that it was the queen of heaven or some guy from the year 2525 taking bored immortals on a time safari to see the brutals. There's not a lot there to hang my hat on (yet). But I'm working on it.

Ummm, NO.

Luke 16:19-31

King James Version

19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:​

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

The spiritual example is set here...NO ONE comes back for any reason. Period.

God`s Holy Word is expected to be enough for us, NOT "ghosts", or witchcraft, or "prophets" since we`re past that phase of the church. Please, don`t be sucked into this nonsense or tricked into participating in demonic activities.

 

[NKBJ]

gregr,
I've read the parable too and I'm aware of people drawing from it the conclusion you stated. My personal experience does not agrees with your interpretation. Neither does my interpretation.
Note, according to the parable the way that cannot be passed through is from one place of the dead to another place of the dead. And, we know from examples given in scripture that people can even be returned to Earth in their physical form after they are three days very dead.
The point of the parable, the punch line, is that if people were not convinced by Moses and the prophets then a returned dead man (Christ) won't convince them either.
Any way, that's my take on it.

 

[Bartman]

I seem to remember Moses and Elijah being dead by the time Jesus went up the hill with Pete and the thunder boys. They both managed to put in an appearance during the Transfiguration. At least that's what the gospels said.

 

[foszoe]

Ummm, NO.

Luke 16:19-31​

​

King James Version​

​

19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:​

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

The spiritual example is set here...NO ONE comes back for any reason. Period.

God`s Holy Word is expected to be enough for us, NOT "ghosts", or witchcraft, or "prophets" since we`re past that phase of the church. Please, don`t be sucked into this nonsense or tricked into participating in demonic activities.

Abraham was dead. Must be made up!

 

[Nevermore]

I seem to remember Moses and Elijah being dead by the time Jesus went up the hill with Pete and the thunder boys. They both managed to put in an appearance during the Transfiguration. At least that's what the gospels said.

Certainly, and they spent their time talking to Christ and Christ alone about His departure. In fact, the only voice speaking to the 3 living men was God, and it told them to listen to Jesus, not even mentioning Moses or Elijah.

Furthermore, the Transfiguration is a notable event precisely owing to its uniqueness, and once again its entire focus was Christ and revealed nothing that Jesus hadn't already explained to His earthly followers in terms of His coming death, ressurrection etc.

 

[NKBJ]

The important part I took away from it is that if a return to life actually happens as with Lazarus then our creator was behind it. However, that's not the same as a passed loved one coming to interact with the living. That does happen but I certainly don't know how it works.
As an example, our grandfather came to my brother in a dream and told him the name of the town where my brother would live. However, the little settlement of that name died and went away long ago. Turned out that when my brother made arrangements to move up into central Texas he afterward learned that the location is where that settlement had been. So OK, Grandad did that for a reason but really, what was the point? Don't know.

Well, to get back to Fatima for a minute, apparently Father Gruner (I'm still reading "Fatima Priest") was a real lightning rod when it comes to garnering attention from the anti-traditionalists. Seems he was a real scrapper, willing to fight the established hierarchy for the preservation of traditional Catholicism, resisting the changes brought by the 60's and 70's. In that vein, and with his devotion to Mary, Fatima was extremely important to him and he pushed for disclosure and what would be action appropriate to doing as she said.

Time to go finish making the lemon/thai thyme/chicken stir fry, toss in the bok choi (right out of garden patch) and boil some rice. The better 2/3's has been slaving over a hot sewing machine all day and she's gonna be hungry.