Can a non violent felon hunt in Indiana?

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  • DadSmith

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    I had an acquaintance ask me if he would be allowed to hunt deer in Indiana with some kind of weapon. I told him I do not know but believe it was not a good idea for him to be around or in possession of any weapons until he finds out for sure. So he ask me to see if I could find out something for him. So INGO has several lawyers here I figured I might get him an answer or at least a phone number to one of our INGO lawyers to talk to about it.
    He has a non violent Federal felony so you know. That is what he told me. So I ask INGO does he have a right to hunt deer with something bow, crossbow, muzzleloader?

    Even a phone number would be great you can pm me that information if you want to help out.
     

    ditcherman

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    I appreciate that you recognize that INGO has many lawyers, and being one of those INGOlawyers (note this is very different from an actual real life lawyer) I would be happy to help send this post too, off the rails.
    OK, seriously though, I had my legal team (google) dig up this 359082002
    and this indiana-gun-laws-for-felons
    The former seems to indicate that under Indiana law a non violent felon can posses but not purchase. Therefore he could hunt.
    The latter seems very clear that under federal laws, any crime punishable (not punished) by a year or more (in Indiana, a felony) makes that person a prohibited possessor.
    Judge Wapner would rule no, for firearms. I have exhausted my budget (lunchtime) on my legal team (once again, google) so I can't yet answer the question concerning the bow or muzzleloader. But I will be happy to send your friend a bill.



    P.S. I think this is a pretty reasonable answer considering I have been accused of being one of those "Muuhhh Ryyytts" types by that one guy on here.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Think of two parallel railroad tracks when thinking of the two governments and their prohibitions:

    State of Indiana=> +-+-+-+-+-+-+- . . . .

    Federal .Gov=> +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- . . . .

    The analysis begins just like every Finite Math analysis, check the most restrictive first (feds).

    Federal prohibitions in 18 USC §922, almost all felonies.

    Indiana prohibitions in SVF and DB, the 26 proscribed felonies and domestic battery convictions.

    Remember Indiana's prohibition is more narrow, but is deeper. In Indiana SVF/DB is ANY firearm, including a wheel lock.

    The analysis always begins with: 1. What is the conviction? Answer this question and the rest falls in place.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    I appreciate that you recognize that INGO has many lawyers, and being one of those INGOlawyers (note this is very different from an actual real life lawyer) I would be happy to help send this post too, off the rails.
    OK, seriously though, I had my legal team (google) dig up this 359082002
    and this indiana-gun-laws-for-felons
    The former seems to indicate that under Indiana law a non violent felon can posses but not purchase. Therefore he could hunt.
    The latter seems very clear that under federal laws, any crime punishable (not punished) by a year or more (in Indiana, a felony) makes that person a prohibited possessor.
    Judge Wapner would rule no, for firearms. I have exhausted my budget (lunchtime) on my legal team (once again, google) so I can't yet answer the question concerning the bow or muzzleloader. But I will be happy to send your friend a bill.



    P.S. I think this is a pretty reasonable answer considering I have been accused of being one of those "Muuhhh Ryyytts" types by that one guy on here.
    OMG, no! Federal law still applies.

    If you have (nearly) any felony conviction no guns or ammunition for you (NOTE: federal law, but not Indiana law, excludes blackpowder guns).
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Let's run some examples:

    Jasper Lee Cledus Lee Longstreet Lee, III has a conviction for Operation a Motor Vehicle While Intoximakated with a Prior Conviction as a Level 6 Felony, it went in and remains a felony. How do we determine if Jasper is a prohibited person.

    We look to the federal statutes and find 18 USC 922(g)(1), he is a prohibited person AND CANNOT own guns.

    However, we note that federal law treats blackpowder guns as non-firearms, AND we not that Indiana law does not list OWI w/ Prior as included in SVF. We conclude that Jasper can have himself a blackpowder raffle gun.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    More examples from the award winning seminar series "Load & Make Ready: Understanding Indiana Firearms Law" by Kirt Freeland, Attorney at Law. How many can you correctly call?


    1. Jasper Lee Longstreet Lee, III has conviction for OWI w/ prior, Level 6 felony?

    2. Silent Bob tells you he has felony for Dealing Xanax outside a Village Pantry?

    3. Cledus has conviction for Domestic Battery, but “was long time ago” and “another county”?


    4. Kirt Freeland has Criminal Mischief and Public Intox when he was at Purdue in 2007?

    5. Jay, Silent Bob’s friend, wants to go on Spring Break to Colorado where marijuana is legal and “burn it up, dude”? What are state and federal consequences?

    6. Snuffy was discharged from U.S. Army Dishonorably. He wants a “rifle gun”?

    7. Jimmy Joe has a Burglary conviction from “another county” and tells you that it has “fallen off his record”?

    8. Ricky Bobby has conviction for “Battery”, will not tell you who against?
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    1. No modern guns for Jasper, but blackpowder is OK.

    2. Silent Bob is SVF if still felony. No guns under fed or state law.

    3. Cledus is prohibited possessor unless civil rights restoration under 35-47-4-7

    4. Kirt, if misdemeanor convictions, is OK; if felony, NO.

    5. Cannot have guns or ammo if burning the devil's weed.

    6. Dishonorable discharge is prohibited person

    7. Jimmy Joe is out of luck, unless pardon or expunged (always check!)

    8. When they will not tell you who the victim is, 99.9999153% it is Domestic Battery. No guns.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    ALWAYS FIND OUT WHAT THE CONVICTION IS.

    Many times they have purposefully forgotten or will attempt to minimize their actions (had a guy tell me, "oh, I got in a bar fight . . . he stabbed a guy in the neck in a bar, from behind).

    ALWAYS FIND OUT WHAT THE CONVICTION IS.
     

    DadSmith

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    ALWAYS FIND OUT WHAT THE CONVICTION IS.

    Many times they have purposefully forgotten or will attempt to minimize their actions (had a guy tell me, "oh, I got in a bar fight . . . he stabbed a guy in the neck in a bar, from behind).

    ALWAYS FIND OUT WHAT THE CONVICTION IS.
    That's why I told him he needs to contact an attorney such as yourself. If you would be so inclined would you take a call from him? He can explain it to you and you can charge whatever you normally do. This is way beyond what I can understand or deal with because his felony is at the Federal level so wouldn't that make him subject to not only state law but Federal laws concerning this? Anyway if you would be willing to take a call from him PM me your number and he can deal directly with you about it. You might pick up a client.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    That's why I told him he needs to contact an attorney such as yourself. If you would be so inclined would you take a call from him? He can explain it to you and you can charge whatever you normally do. This is way beyond what I can understand or deal with because his felony is at the Federal level so wouldn't that make him subject to not only state law but Federal laws concerning this? Anyway if you would be willing to take a call from him PM me your number and he can deal directly with you about it. You might pick up a client.
    He can call me, just make an appointment.

    I have been doing expungements BEFORE there was an expungment statute, lol (only PCRs and pardons back then, all this was orchard. I wore an onion on my belt . . .)

     

    HoughMade

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    ***not legal advise***

    I am discussing an issue theoretically as part of an exchange of ideas and am not giving legal advice to any person.

    I am not aware of any Indiana or federal law that prohibits a felon from possessing a bow or crossbow.
     

    DadSmith

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    He can call me, just make an appointment.

    I have been doing expungements BEFORE there was an expungment statute, lol (only PCRs and pardons back then, all this was orchard. I wore an onion on my belt . . .)


    Okay I gave him your information. Now it's up to him to call. He said he appealing now has a court date in federal appeals court on August 26th he's hoping they will drop it to a misdemeanor.
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    More examples from the award winning seminar series "Load & Make Ready: Understanding Indiana Firearms Law" by Kirt Freeland, Attorney at Law. How many can you correctly call?


    1. Jasper Lee Longstreet Lee, III has conviction for OWI w/ prior, Level 6 felony?

    2. Silent Bob tells you he has felony for Dealing Xanax outside a Village Pantry?

    3. Cledus has conviction for Domestic Battery, but “was long time ago” and “another county”?


    4. Kirt Freeland has Criminal Mischief and Public Intox when he was at Purdue in 2007?

    5. Jay, Silent Bob’s friend, wants to go on Spring Break to Colorado where marijuana is legal and “burn it up, dude”? What are state and federal consequences?

    6. Snuffy was discharged from U.S. Army Dishonorably. He wants a “rifle gun”?

    7. Jimmy Joe has a Burglary conviction from “another county” and tells you that it has “fallen off his record”?

    8. Ricky Bobby has conviction for “Battery”, will not tell you who against?
    Is this a podcast somewhere?
    This guy sounds fascinating. Maybe he could be a guest on that one Saturday night radio show.
     

    ECS686

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    Kirk, correct me if I am mistaken. I believe as far as muzzle loaders. only no 11 percussion caps or the like. ZERO inlines with 209 Shotgun Primers. Primers are considered ammunition.

    Also it can make a difference if one is a Federal Felon or a State Felon more so than non violent vs violent as well as if one is under Supervised Release sanctions as well.
     

    DadSmith

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    Kirk, correct me if I am mistaken. I believe as far as muzzle loaders. only no 11 percussion caps or the like. ZERO inlines with 209 Shotgun Primers. Primers are considered ammunition.

    Also it can make a difference if one is a Federal Felon or a State Felon more so than non violent vs violent as well as if one is under Supervised Release sanctions as well.
    This is the confusing part and I'm not going to say anything about it because I do not know. My advice to him at this moment was to stay away from anything that can be said is a weapon. He is doing a great job since he got out I don't want to see him screw up and go back in.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    This is the confusing part and I'm not going to say anything about it because I do not know. My advice to him at this moment was to stay away from anything that can be said is a weapon. He is doing a great job since he got out I don't want to see him screw up and go back in.

    Then tell him is best bet is turkey hunting.


    With a credit card.



    At the local Grocery store. Or a fancy place like Tyner Pond Farm if he wants free range fresh birds. :):
     

    DadSmith

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    Then tell him is best bet is turkey hunting.


    With a credit card.



    At the local Grocery store. Or a fancy place like Tyner Pond Farm if he wants free range fresh birds. :):
    Or better yet go fishing as far as I know he shouldn't get into trouble fishing unless the fillet knife would be considered a weapon.
     

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