New BATF ruling on stabilizing braces today

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  • yotehunt

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    When it becomes registered, then you cannot sell it with out de-milling it and notifying the atf of that. Or, it stays the same but the buyer needs an approved stamp to buy that nfa item. As far as not making you put your name and info on the side, you didn't really manufacture or modify it, but I would put the nfa markings on it like my sbr requires.

    Far as I know, you notify atf when barrel lenth or caliber changes or the RIFLE becomes shorter than approved for, like a REAL stock that is shorter. Its nothing more than a memo.
     

    defaultdotxbe

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    That's my read - and also NO EXEMPTION for possessing a "firearm" during the 120 day period, or while the application processed.

    A person is only 'covered' if they file WITHIN the 120 day window, from the date of publication. It hasn't been published yet (checked 10 minutes ago), so technically, anyone proceeding right now, is not exempt or covered.

    When my tin foil hat too tight, I wonder:

    If there is malicious intent, and a trap, this could be it (but unlikely). Get a whole bunch of people to go online and ADMIT and agree that they possess an unregistered NFA firearm(s) "...that are: 1) equipped with a stabilizing brace; 2) meet the definition of "rifle" under federal law; and 3) have a barrel or barrels less than sixteen (16) inches in length. By proceeding with this application, you are certifying that you and the firearm you intend to register meet the tax-exempt parameters set forth in ATF Final Rule 2021R-08F." " ATF's eForms website

    Then, NEVER actually publish the rule. No publish, no exemption. Then go round up the people that jumped the gun. The longer this does not get Published or withdrawn, the more fish in the net.

    They sould easily make up some rationalization like "upon further review and consideration..." or "Due to the language that confuses ignorant peasants, we will be re-writing...." and never publish anything.

    My hat is on secure at the moment, and I don't really think this is the plan, but it's an interesting story. I'll crap myself if this actually happens.
    No publish, no exemption, but no publish also means no SBR. The previous holding that braced pistols are still just pistols remains in force.
     

    OneBadV8

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    why require engraving at all as long as the firearm has a S/N.
    because it didn't come from a manufacturer that way. Their reasoning is when you "build it" into an SBR, YOU are becoming the manufacturer of the new firearm. So engraving it registers you as the manufacturer for their records.

    Not sure how the rest will play out. Seems like it'll be pretty hard to keep track if engraving isn't required on these, but yet they're still considered an SBR.
     

    tcecil88

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    does this fall under the rule???

    View attachment 250466
    JMHO, but I wouldn't post any pictures and ask any "is this legal?" questions. If nothing else, we shouldn't be giving the AFT lurkers on here anymore bright ideas. I don't think bird's head type shotguns were mentioned, but it will be eventually if people start asking about it frequently. I would err on the side of caution and say these would be included as it is equipped with a brace.
     

    millsusaf

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    because it didn't come from a manufacturer that way. Their reasoning is when you "build it" into an SBR, YOU are becoming the manufacturer of the new firearm. So engraving it registers you as the manufacturer for their records.

    Not sure how the rest will play out. Seems like it'll be pretty hard to keep track if engraving isn't required on these, but yet they're still considered an SBR.

    They seem to take the stance for this amnesty period that any brace attached pistol is a SBR regardless of who the maker is; factory braced pistol or personally receiver built braced pistol. That is their focus, get braced pistols registered.

    But if you want to take a virgin receiver (not currently existing braced pistol) and build a SBR you as the "maker" need to engrave your markings on it.

    That is an approach I've heard some talk about. Strip down their braced attached pistols, go through the regular Form1 process, pay the $200 tax stamp and prevent incriminating themselves should the ATFs or local LEOs enforcement descretion change.
     

    ghitch75

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    JMHO, but I wouldn't post any pictures and ask any "is this legal?" questions. If nothing else, we shouldn't be giving the AFT lurkers on here anymore bright ideas. I don't think bird's head type shotguns were mentioned, but it will be eventually if people start asking about it frequently. I would err on the side of caution and say these would be included as it is equipped with a brace.
    not mine just seen it on the net and just was wondering.....btw the Nazi's can see it too
     

    Noble Sniper

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    Sounds shady….. a week ago today I filed my form 1 and paid my $200. I cannot put a stock on this UNTIL I receive the blessing of the AFT. And when I do get the ok I have to have my info etc laser etched into the receiver. Ok….. now someone who files a special form 1 for a braced pistol….. no need to take off the brace…. No $200 fee…. No need to engrave info once you’re approved but yet they are both considered SBR’s????? This gets dumber the farther it goes!!!
     
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    norman428

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    Sounds shady….. a week ago today I filed my form 1 and paid my $200. I cannot put a stick on this UNTIL I receive the blessing of the AFT. And when I do get the ok I have to have my info etc laser etched into the receiver. Ok….. now someone who files a special form 1 for a braced pistol….. no need to take off the brace…. No $200 fee…. No need to engrave info once you’re approved but yet they are both considered SBR’s????? This gets dumber the farther it goes!!!
    Agreed, I understand waiving the fee since people with a brace didn't knowingly buy or build and SBR at the time of purchase. But the rest of it seems sketchy, I'm almost wondering if the stamp has to have some sort of special mark on it to show it was part of this exemption. Even then, there are so many braced pistols on the market right now It will be impossible to figure it all out.
     

    OneBadV8

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    Agreed, I understand waiving the fee since people with a brace didn't knowingly buy or build and SBR at the time of purchase. But the rest of it seems sketchy, I'm almost wondering if the stamp has to have some sort of special mark on it to show it was part of this exemption. Even then, there are so many braced pistols on the market right now It will be impossible to figure it all out.
    and if it is grandfathered, how many will "register" SBRs during the brace amnesty just to get out of the $200 stamp?

    Seems pretty stupid on the ATF's part unless they make you register the brace itself.

    hopefully this is challenged right away and nothing happens. It's stupid all around.
     

    tcecil88

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    not mine just seen it on the net and just was wondering.....btw the Nazi's can see it too.
    I wasn't trying to make you angry and I apologize if I did. I know the "Nazi's" are watching and that was the point of my post.
    So many people have written the AFT with the "is this legal?" questions, posted pictures and videos online showing them shouldering braces, pictures published in national publications showing them shouldering braces, and the like. Yes, the ATF said that "incidental shouldering" was ok and didn't constitute a redesign, but people just took it and ran with it.
    I know people have questions about what is legal and it's not like you can just walk into a police department or the local AFT office and show them a gun without a potentially bad outcome. But posting a picture and asking a question "is this legal?" when we all know what we are facing right now just gives the AFT and any other Anti 2A person that's watching ideas for another thing to chase after. The question can be asked without posting a picture.
    We, as the people who are the targets of the AFT and the Anti 2A establishment, should tighten up, work together and think about what we are saying or what picture we are posting here or any other gun forum.
    I post pictures of guns I have bought or built because I am proud of them and think other people might find these interesting. I hope people enjoy the pictures I post and are maybe inspired to build or modify a gun of their own. I enjoy looking at pictures of guns that other people have built because it inspires and motivates me in my builds. I have, however, quit posting pictures of guns that are under scrutiny because we all know the AFT and the Anti 2A people do watch what we are talking about and posting.
    As usual, this is just my 2 cents and YMMV.
     

    BR8818

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    When it becomes registered, then you cannot sell it with out de-milling it and notifying the atf of that. Or, it stays the same but the buyer needs an approved stamp to buy that nfa item. As far as not making you put your name and info on the side, you didn't really manufacture or modify it, but I would put the nfa markings on it like my sbr requires.

    Far as I know, you notify atf when barrel lenth or caliber changes or the RIFLE becomes shorter than approved for, like a REAL stock that is shorter. Its nothing more than a memo.
    You can sell a form 1 lower as long as it's not in sbr configuration you don't have to notify the AFT either.
     

    ghitch75

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    I wasn't trying to make you angry and I apologize if I did. I know the "Nazi's" are watching and that was the point of my post.
    So many people have written the AFT with the "is this legal?" questions, posted pictures and videos online showing them shouldering braces, pictures published in national publications showing them shouldering braces, and the like. Yes, the ATF said that "incidental shouldering" was ok and didn't constitute a redesign, but people just took it and ran with it.
    I know people have questions about what is legal and it's not like you can just walk into a police department or the local AFT office and show them a gun without a potentially bad outcome. But posting a picture and asking a question "is this legal?" when we all know what we are facing right now just gives the AFT and any other Anti 2A person that's watching ideas for another thing to chase after. The question can be asked without posting a picture.
    We, as the people who are the targets of the AFT and the Anti 2A establishment, should tighten up, work together and think about what we are saying or what picture we are posting here or any other gun forum.
    I post pictures of guns I have bought or built because I am proud of them and think other people might find these interesting. I hope people enjoy the pictures I post and are maybe inspired to build or modify a gun of their own. I enjoy looking at pictures of guns that other people have built because it inspires and motivates me in my builds. I have, however, quit posting pictures of guns that are under scrutiny because we all know the AFT and the Anti 2A people do watch what we are talking about and posting.
    As usual, this is just my 2 cents and YMMV.

    oh no not mad at all....was just wondering as I said
     
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