17 year old kid shot dead by Neighborhood Watch "Captain"

[cobber]

And because of all the possible ways it could have gone down, right off the bat I've got enough "reasonable doubt" that, without the guy confessing to being a murderer, I'd most likely vote to acquit if I was on his jury.

Right now you have no facts, so it would be your duty to acquit if you were on the jury. But that would be based on the presumption of innocence, not on reasonable doubt.

After evidence comes in, you might think there was a real possibility that the NWC did not commit a criminal offense, which would be reasonable doubt.

All we have right now are news reports. Who knows if any of that information could be evidence at trial?

Right now we're still at the probable cause phase. Might not go further than that...

 

[BillyT]

This story is fishy. The story seems to be as many stated sensationalized and anti gun. I'm not sure why race is involved other than to demonize one group - take your angle. Ofcourse the 17 year youth was on his way to get skittles for his younger brother - not sure the purpose of this tidbit other than to further demonize the "crime watch captain".

I could see the crime watch attempting to contain the youth. After he identified himself. I could see the youth go crazy & attacking the Cpt from which the the end result is the kid being shot.
Putting myself in the Cpt shoes he didn't know this kid or what was going to happen after being attacked. Either way the media is fanning flames.To put this in perspective if a security guard thought I was a threat called the cops and I go nuts punching him (can be deadly). I'm sure these actions would be defenseless. I wish I could read the report.

Prayers to those involved

 

[Jake46184]

Be careful to assume that anything anyone wants is a "right." You have very few rights. His parents are using the media as whores because they can't get preferential "rights" to which they believe they are entitled.

Also be sure to carefully read what information, sensationalized as it may be, the liberal media provides. The kid did not live in the neighborhood. He was visiting. The NWC had likely never seen the kid before.

There's one person alive who knows what went down and he has told his side to the police. They didn't arrest him. Unless his story changes, the likelihood of him being charged with a crime is low. The likelihood of him being convicted of a crime (or found guilty in a civil suit) is pretty much zero.

 

[hornadylnl]

Be careful to assume that anything anyone wants is a "right." You have very few rights. His parents are using the media as whores because they can't get preferential "rights" to which they believe they are entitled.

Also be sure to carefully read what information, sensationalized as it may be, the liberal media provides. The kid did not live in the neighborhood. He was visiting. The NWC had likely never seen the kid before.

There's one person alive who knows what went down and he has told his side to the police. They didn't arrest him. Unless his story changes, the likelihood of him being charged with a crime is low. The likelihood of him being convicted of a crime (or found guilty in a civil suit) is pretty much zero.

Should I have to knock on every door in the neighborhood and introduce any visitors I may have?

 

[squirrelhntr]

A dispatcher told Zimmerman that a squad car would be dispatched and that police would handle it. Did the lad pull Zimmerman from his vehicle? Or, exactly why did Zimmerman exit his vehicle?




















.

 

[KLB]

How would you expect a child to act if a stranger were following them and then confronted them? We teach our children to fear strangers, and to fight and run from them.

 

[Roadie]

How would you expect a child to act if a stranger were following them and then confronted them? We teach our children to fear strangers, and to fight and run from them.

I don't know about you, but my wife and I didn't teach OUR kids to fight strangers(especially strangers that are older, taller, heavier and armed), but we did teach them to run from them..

 

[rgrimm01]

How is one suppose to respond if a SUV is shadowing you as you walk down a sidewalk? I would think situational awareness would trigger "high alert". If the teenager was 70 yds from the house, he should have made a break for it thus improving his numbers by adding 1 very PO'd father. How often do we hear the kids nowadays talking about "how we got rights" coupled with the mentality of being fire and bullet proof as we all were when we were 17? Add to that an overly enthusiastic NWC who possibly overstepped his authority. In this case, twas truly a recipe for disaster with tragic results.

I believe that if the authorities have not charged him yet, they feel they might not have a winnable case. I also feel NWC will lose the civil case.

 

[hornadylnl]

How is one suppose to respond if a SUV is shadowing you as you walk down a sidewalk? I would think situational awareness would trigger "high alert". If the teenager was 70 yds from the house, he should have made a break for it thus improving his numbers by adding 1 very PO'd father. How often do we hear the kids nowadays talking about "how we got rights" coupled with the mentality of being fire and bullet proof as we all were when we were 17? Add to that an overly enthusiastic NWC who possibly overstepped his authority. In this case, twas truly a recipe for disaster with tragic results.

I believe that if the authorities have not charged him yet, they feel they might not have a winnable case. I also feel NWC will lose the civil case.

If simply walking down the street was cause for calling the police, what would Capitan have done if he kid bolted? Fire up his turret mounted mini gun?

 

[rugertoter]

You would think the neighborhood watch would have had some kind of radio or at least a cell phone to contact the police. I wonder why he did not just keep the kid under watch and call the cops? I'm sure they would have responded, and maybe he would not have had to shoot.

 

[KLB]

I don't know about you, but my wife and I didn't teach OUR kids to fight strangers(especially strangers that are older, taller, heavier and armed), but we did teach them to run from them..

If they are grabbed they are supposed to submit?

 

[Roadie]

Since they haven't released the 911 call, we don't have all the info yet. Supposedly he called, they told him to wait.. what he said on the call, and what happened after he hung up, we aren't privy to yet. If the Watch captain was bloody, SOME kind of altercation happened. Either the kid jumped him, or the Watcher dude tried to detain the kid and the kid responded with force.

We may never know the truth..

 

[hornadylnl]

If they are grabbed they are supposed to submit?

Teenagers are punks so if they're grabbed, they must deserve it, right?

 

[Roadie]

If they are grabbed they are supposed to submit?

No, they were taught to try and break free and run, not fight the guy in a street brawl.

 

[hornadylnl]

No, they were taught to try and break free and run, not fight the guy in a street brawl.

So it was a street brawl? Was the kid winning until Capitan shot him?

 

[rgrimm01]

If simply walking down the street was cause for calling the police, what would Capitan have done if he kid bolted? Fire up his turret mounted mini gun?

Noted. I am thinking along the lines that this kid is athletic(played organized football so at the very least assume some level of coordination) and scared. Covering 70 yds. (the distance of the altercation location and the teenager's father's house) would take what, 8-10 seconds? I am betting NWC would have struggled to get his seatbelt off before the teenager was sitting on his father's couch...

 

[cobber]

Be careful to assume that anything anyone wants is a "right." You have very few rights. His parents are using the media as whores because they can't get preferential "rights" to which they believe they are entitled.

I would say that although it isn't enumerated in the hallowed constitution, parents have the right to hear the 911 call relating to their son's death. I think that's one the Creator wouldn't have a problem with, even if the founding fathers somehow omitted it.

"Preferential" rights? Do you have kids? Would you just sit on your hands waiting for someone to decide whether you should get to listen to the audio? I'd damn well be rattling some cages if it were my child. I would want to know what happened.

Media whores? You're just not going to cut his parents a break, are you? I'm going out on a limb here and saying whether the kid or the NWC was in the wrong, the parents are entitled to a presumption, that they loved their boy and want to know what happened. That is what we would expect of parents, if the word 'family' means anything.

 

[Oliver]

This is a terrible. I can't think of ONE circumstance where the killer could be justified. He obviously confronted the person that he thought was "suspicious", and said something to him. The end result was his finger pulling a trigger. There is nothing that can change those facts.

 

[hornadylnl]

Noted. I am thinking along the lines that this kid is athletic(played organized football so at the very least assume some level of coordination) and scared. Covering 70 yds. would take what, 8-10 seconds? I am betting NWC would have struggled to get his seatbelt off in time...

Since we're "thinking" aloud here, I'll join in. The self appointed neighborhood watch captain/mall ninja is a 26 year old college student, he must have got tired of flipping burgers and enrolled in a couple classes at the local community college. His battery on a police officer charges were probably dropped because his dad plays cards with the Chief of Police. He was white and the kid was black so he must have a white sheet and hood in his closet at home. He knew he screwed up so he proceeded to beat himself up and made up the cover story to prove self defense. Since he won't respond to the media, he's definitely covering something.

These posts are definitely exposing our personal biases and they seem to be affecting how we judge this particular scenario. None of us know for sure what really happened here. The kid could have instigated it, the guy could have. What we do know is that the kid is dead.

I'll readily admit I'm biased against self appointed busy bodies who have nothing better to do with their time than worry about what I'm doing. Chalk this guy up to reason # 9,834,612 why I don't live in a HOA/gated community.

 

[Roadie]

So it was a street brawl? Was the kid winning until Capitan shot him?

IMO:

Since they haven't released the 911 call, we don't have all the info yet. Supposedly he called, they told him to wait.. what he said on the call, and what happened after he hung up, we aren't privy to yet. If the Watch captain was bloody, SOME kind of altercation happened. Either the kid jumped him, or the Watcher dude tried to detain the kid and the kid responded with force.

We may never know the truth..

I was just thinking out loud. The Watcher of the Community dude was dirty and bloody, it stands to reason SOMETHING happened to him BEFORE he got a shot off, rather than after. n'est-ce pas?