Michigan High School Shooting, Teen Kills 3, Wounds 8

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  • Cameramonkey

    www.thechosen.tv
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    I think you are unable to see past the firearm somehow. Is it more dangerous than a vehicle?

    What if the kid had stolen his parents vehicle and run over a bunch of classmates on the playground? Would you be clamoring for the car keys to have been locked up because the car was inherently dangerous?
    In lieu of the post below, I'll give a limited response.

    What legit use is the gun at school?
    Now, what legit use is the car at school?
    How about scissors? (assuming he had gone on a stabbing spree) Once again, legit uses need to be considered. But then again, we arent talking about generalities.

    Because that’s what we are talking about in this thread. Why is that so hard to understand? We aren’t talking about generalities. You are the only one doing that. We are talking about a specific set of people who performed specific actions and who need to be held accountable for those actions.

    Everyone has a choice. The shooter had a choice. And he is solely responsible for the consequences of his choice. The parents had a choice. If their actions constitute negligence, they should be responsible for the consequences of that choice.

    I don’t get why you are so hung up on make believe scenarios here. We aren’t talking about “what if’s”. We are talking about a specific case and the specific actions that each player made.
    THIS.
     
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    Jaybird1980

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    Because that’s what we are talking about in this thread. Why is that so hard to understand? We aren’t talking about generalities. You are the only one doing that. We are talking about a specific set of people who performed specific actions and who need to be held accountable for those actions.

    Everyone has a choice. The shooter had a choice. And he is solely responsible for the consequences of his choice. The parents had a choice. If their actions constitute negligence, they should be responsible for the consequences of that choice.

    I don’t get why you are so hung up on make believe scenarios here. We aren’t talking about “what if’s”. We are talking about a specific case and the specific actions that each player made.
    So should prosecution be based on Laws or Specific set of people.

    Just because someone does something stupid, that doesn't make it illegal.

    Now if the parents were aware he wanted to shoot a place up and then obtained the gun and allowed access then they are complicit. IMO

    Like KLB said, I will wait to see what the actual story is. Not what some media or some overzealous prosecutor is saying.
     

    BugI02

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    Because that’s what we are talking about in this thread. Why is that so hard to understand? We aren’t talking about generalities. You are the only one doing that. We are talking about a specific set of people who performed specific actions and who need to be held accountable for those actions.

    Everyone has a choice. The shooter had a choice. And he is solely responsible for the consequences of his choice. The parents had a choice. If their actions constitute negligence, they should be responsible for the consequences of that choice.

    I don’t get why you are so hung up on make believe scenarios here. We aren’t talking about “what if’s”. We are talking about a specific case and the specific actions that each player made.
    Odd, I thought the thread title referred to 'Michigan School Shooting' and as such related to all aspects of it

    You profferred the opinion that these specific parents should be culpable, to which I disagreed unless that was a uniform standard, which it is blatantly apparent that it is not


    'We are talking about a specific case and the specific actions that each player made.'
    Indeed. The problem seems to be that I disagree with you, not why. If you cannot see that either all parents should be held to your standard or none should, then that standard is arbitrary and inconsistent. I'm curious about the parameters for its application
     

    Hoosierdood

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    Then why ARE you attempting to spread responsibility for his actions to the parents.
    I’m not. He is responsible for his actions. Nobody else. 100% on him. I think we agree on this.

    His parents are also responsible for their actions. (not for the kids actions) If their actions are deemed to be negligent, then they should be responsible for the consequences. This is what I think you’re not understanding. You have an idea stuck in your head about what I’m trying to say, and no matter how clear I try to be you just can’t grasp it.
     

    buckwacker

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    Family neighbor dishes a little dirt on scumbaggery of the parents. If true, it's an indication that they might bear some responsibility for what transpired, or at least for breaking their kid.

     

    radar8756

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    In previous school incidents there has usually been stories of teasing / bullying of the shooter by the victims - I have not seen this (yet) in this case
     

    KittySlayer

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    In previous school incidents there has usually been stories of teasing / bullying of the shooter by the victims - I have not seen this (yet) in this case
    ...and often with little or no action by the school administration. Everyone (parents, kids, administration) knows the teasing/bullying is happening but they do nothing about it.

    As noted above this is 100% the kid's decision to do evil, NO excuses. That does not absolve others for their failures that contributed to the event.

    And as a parent there are ways to protect your child from being bullied. Not all of them necessarily legal but I never permitted repeated abuse of my son when he was young.
     

    HoughMade

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    In previous school incidents there has usually been stories of teasing / bullying of the shooter by the victims - I have not seen this (yet) in this case
    I heard early on, that the kid was bullied. Don't know if the victims were involved.. I don't know any details.
     

    Jaybird1980

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    In previous school incidents there has usually been stories of teasing / bullying of the shooter by the victims - I have not seen this (yet) in this case
    I have read reports of bullying.

     

    buckwacker

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    Remember when bullying was the left's crusade du jour? I assume they dropped it because they wanted to use the tactics once they got woke and decided to cancel everyone that disagreed with them.
     

    Libertarian01

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    Still waiting to hear what "I am to own up to".

    A sincere Merry Christmas to you and yours, Sir.

    I don't think you should own up to anything. "I" never said you should.

    However, back in the 50's a "red" was a commie.:noway: By your name are you telling us that you are a covert commie sleeper agent?:shady: Now would be the time to own up...:wavey:

    Regards and Merry Christmas,

    Doug
     

    jamil

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    Because that’s what we are talking about in this thread. Why is that so hard to understand? We aren’t talking about generalities. You are the only one doing that. We are talking about a specific set of people who performed specific actions and who need to be held accountable for those actions.

    Everyone has a choice. The shooter had a choice. And he is solely responsible for the consequences of his choice. The parents had a choice. If their actions constitute negligence, they should be responsible for the consequences of that choice.

    I don’t get why you are so hung up on make believe scenarios here. We aren’t talking about “what if’s”. We are talking about a specific case and the specific actions that each player made.
    I guess, sure. If we're gonna hold parents responsible when their negligence ends up in grave harm to others, let's be consistent. Also, let's apply the law as it was intended, and not as a tool for political purposes. Charging the parents with involuntary manslaughter is an expansion of the current law.
     

    jamil

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    Then why ARE you attempting to spread responsibility for his actions to the parents. Absent evidence that the parents wanted and encouraged him to take revenge on his classmates, I just don't see it

    It seems the Alec Baldwin contretemps redux, that somehow others are responsible or share responsibility because Baldwin CHOSE to point a firearm at another and pull the trigger (or fan the hammer, if you will). Baldwin is the only one responsible for Baldwin's choices and actions

    The same holds true for Ethan Crumbley
    While I don't agree with the specific charges on the parents, I think the parents do share some moral responsibility, because the kid is 15 years old and they are responsible for him. But I think it's absurd to charge them with Involuntary Manslaughter. Something more fitting would be some kind of negligence charge.
     

    jamil

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    A lot of this problem starts with "parents" who wouldn't begin to know how to parent, because they themselves had none.

    Be it kids being "raised" by single parents or running from mom to dad, the discipline of a household and supporting educational facility is something of the past.

    We now have generations of people with no grasp of accountability.
    Parenting doesn't come with instructions upon conception, and there's no permit required to become parents. So most people do the best they know how. But if there is one lesson everyone really needs to teach their kids, it's accountability. Parents that don't hold their kids accountable for doing what they should know better than to do, end up unleashing new adults upon the world who go through life inflicting their irresponsibility upon the world.
     
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