New BATF ruling on stabilizing braces today

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  • JAL

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    They are usurping our rights, evidenced by the lack of buying, selling, and trading, without even publishing it. We all know the goal is to disrupt gun ownership and they are doing just that without publishing it. The question in the post you quoted was asking why they would ever publish it if they can achieve some of the results they desire without those pesky lawsuits and court rulings…


    If I read correctly INGO took down the ads offering to sell.
    Palmetto State Armory has an announcement regarding "braced pistols" that they will put an indefinite moratorium on selling any when the rule is published to the Federal Register. I haven't checked All the Usual Suspects, but would expect them to do the same on or before when it's published.
     

    tackdriver

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    ...

    It doesn't serve the purposes of We the People, it doesn't serve the power of the government in any satisfying manner and it doesn't do anything to resolve any conditional problem of the present or future.
    ...
    - They really don't give two S**ts about We the People.
    - They aren't trying to solve any problems, present or future.
    - They're smug and confident because the masters they serve already have power, not because they are trying to get it.

    This little brace game is about demonstrating their tribes power to those below - the People; and demonstrating their usefulness to those above - ??? It's also about sibling rivalry with the other alphabet soup. "Look mom! They spied on Trump and raided his home, then put parents on the watch list, but we made felons out of 40 million people (gun owners no less), and made them spin in circles until they puked!"
     

    Gravyman

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    Palmetto State Armory has an announcement regarding "braced pistols" that they will put an indefinite moratorium on selling any when the rule is published to the Federal Register. I haven't checked All the Usual Suspects, but would expect them to do the same on or before when it's published.
    They've already stopped selling braced pistols, so is it right that it hasn't been published to the federal register? This thing is so needlessly confusing
     

    JAL

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    They've already stopped selling braced pistols, so is it right that it hasn't been published to the federal register? This thing is so needlessly confusing
    NO

    See #529 in this thread (previous page) that has link for the ATF web page for their published rules. Only two thus far this year and neither one is the brace rule.

    Save that and check it daily.
     

    JAL

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    They've already stopped selling braced pistols, so is it right that it hasn't been published to the federal register? This thing is so needlessly confusing
    They're still selling AR-15 and AK-47 pistols - without braces though.
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    So... we are basically in a spot where:

    • People thought they were complying with the law. They thought this because the Gov't told them so.
    • Now the Gov't is telling them that they are committing a felony, and can go to jail or be financially ruined.
    • People are scared that "The Man" will come for them in the middle of the night if they don't comply.
    • People are scared that if they DO comply, "The Man" will come for them in the middle of the night.
    • Peoples fear is not unreasonable, and based on the past behavior of the ATF, FBI, and so on.
    • Confusion multiplies fear beyond the reasonable levels.
    Since a brace doesn't make a pistol more dangerous to the public, 'Public Safety' is not the motive. Since the Fed's are refusing to enforce the law in numerous other areas, 'Sense of Duty' isn't the motive.

    Seems to me that the outcome is a bunch of scared, confused, people with guns. Seems like the observed outcome is most likely to be the intended outcome.

    I just hope they all keep their muzzles pointed in the proper direction while this gets sorted out.
    This sums it up so well.
    Especially the part about "Confusion multiplies fear beyond reasonable levels". Confusion is a feature not a bug, to them.
     

    Mgderf

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    Palmetto State Armory has an announcement regarding "braced pistols" that they will put an indefinite moratorium on selling any when the rule is published to the Federal Register. I haven't checked All the Usual Suspects, but would expect them to do the same on or before when it's published.
    So, the mere suggestion of this proposed rule change has had a real and tangible affect on buyers and sellers of an until now legal device.
    Why could this argument not be used to prove standing for a suit?
     

    JAL

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    At my LGS today they said they had been advised that it had been published, as of yesterday.
    Have no idea of their source, but this was one of the owners.
    That link on the previous page goes straight to the Federal Register (not the ATF) where you can look up what has been published by each Federal Agency. As of today it is not published yet. That is the definitive source. It's the right site but wrong bureau. BATFE hasn't published anything yet this year. Not a single notice, rule or proposed rule. Look at prior years and BATFE shows up in the list. Not yet for 2023.
     
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    firecadet613

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    That link on the previous page goes straight to the Federal Register (not the ATF) where you can look up what has been published by each Federal Agency. As of today it is not published yet. That is the definitive source.
    And this is what's mind blowing...
     

    tackdriver

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    So if it's not published to the Federal Register, no one can bring a lawsuit? ...

    Am I understanding this correctly? If so, why the hell would they publish it to the Federal Register?
    You beat me to the punch line! WHY?

    I start with what I know from life in general:

    Organizations don't behave according to the bylaws and charters. They almost always devolve to behave like the people in them.

    Bullies and thugs are not looking for opponents, they are looking for victims. They'll puff themselves up and f*** with their prey, and until a real opponent shows up, then they whistle and step away.

    Bullies and Sociopaths get off on triggering other people, manipulating them, making them act/react. Their 'self' is stroked when they do it, and they are intolerably bored when they aren't. It's the only reason they need or want, and a impulse they can't refuse.

    So, Why would the ATF eagerly pick a fight they are likely to lose, when they seem to have and have little to gain?

    I can't say this applies to them, (I'm not a trained mental health professional) but, statistically, sociopaths are greatly over represented in some occupations, and the ATF and FBI seem to fit the profile; particularly for the 'political' ladder climbers.
    Again, not saying this applies to them, but...a crazy theory emerges.

    If the theory fits...dropping the intended rule in 2021 and letting it hang there may have gotten them a starter fix. As it waned, they drop the 'Final Rule' in the mail to get their peak rush. Right now they may be exhaulting in all the discussions, blogs, videos, and 'expert opinions' they triggered. Everytime someone cries "You should be very affraid!!!" they get another bump, and expect even easier/cheaper/longer lasting highs in the future.

    Publishing normally takes 1-3 days (per the National Registers website), unless the issuer asks them to hold it. Publishing this little turd only invites opponents. Opposition, and any calming effect on the public, kills the high. It also threatens the 'ego', and might make it harder to get a decent rush in the future.

    Why would they make the rule? It's a rush, they're bored want to do something with sparkles, and why not?

    Why let it hang like it is? It maximizes the high. (Just look at the time they got me to waste on writing this!)

    Why would they let it get published? Only when they have to. "Kid, sooner or later you've got to kick'em out of bed and go to work."

    Or maybe there's a war going on internally. Maybe some want to 'go live' and kick start it with a few raids, while others think they'll take an a** pounding and want to avoid this fight. Maybe they just can't get there tribe together on this one (and not because any of them are looking out for the People).

    When you rule out all the rational possibilities, then the Crazy might just be correct.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Once again, see Post 539.
    I'm not saying you are wrong about the sociopath angle. I suspect that is evident by the "arbitrary and capricious" nature of the last several years regarding these things.

    But functionally, you cant really pass a "law" with a remedy to escape penalties, if you dont already have the remedy in place.
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    That link on the previous page goes straight to the Federal Register (not the ATF) where you can look up what has been published by each Federal Agency. As of today it is not published yet. That is the definitive source. It's the right site but wrong bureau. BATFE hasn't published anything yet this year. Not a single notice, rule or proposed rule. Look at prior years and BATFE shows up in the list. Not yet for 2023.
    Just messaged my guy at Larson and Sons to see what his source was.
    Will update.
     
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    JAL

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    Until it's published in the Federal Register, it's not a Rule having the effect of Law. Therefore there's nothing to sue over yet. Rest assured the filings are being prepared based on what has been released for publication. I'm putting my money on BATFE trying to figure out how their web site can absorb tens of millions of Form 1 applications without continuously crashing.
     

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