Choosing a Martial Art for Self Defense

[hammerd13]

Jackson is right, in that you want to pick an artform/skill that involves legitimate resistance from your opponent...at least on occasion. For me, this is BJJ and Krav Maga.

I trained BJJ for several years, Krav Maga for a shorter time, Tae Kwon Do for about a year, and wrestled in high school. I certainly gained something from all of them, but I find BJJ and Krav Maga as the most beneficial. I had excellent teachers in all of these areas, which is extremely important in anything you choose.

BJJ you get REAL resistance from an unwilling opponent virtually every training session. Of course, while learning a new move, your partner "goes along for the ride" to a certain extent, which is important for learning. When you move on from that and are actually rolling with a partner, you get to test your skill FOR REAL in a controlled manner. It's up to you and your partner on how you want the training period to go. It's absolutely wonderful self defense training and can help with stress inoculation too.

Krav Maga was very good too. From my experience, it was an amalgam of wrestling, BJJ, boxing, Muay Tai, Tae Kwon Do, weapons use/defense, and "street fighting" (e.g. head butting, eye gouging, groin kicking, etc.). It really mixes many artforms and brings an intensity to fighting/surviving that you won't find with any other platform. My striking really improved through Krav Maga and opened my eyes on how you must meet aggression with MORE aggression.

 

[1gunaholic]

I took Krav Maga for four years, one thing it taught me was that there’s a better way to kick a man in the “twig and berries!”, it also taught me that “In a knife fight, the winner bleeds, and the looser gushes!”

It’s 100 percent self defense, you’ll never see Krav in a mma cage.

Excellent program, and, yes, defense oriented.

 

[1gunaholic]

The easiest way to lose a fight is to stand and strike. I took a few years of Muai Thai I'm 6'2" and 230lbs. That being said I would mess with one of the older guys at the gym probably 20 years older than me maybe 5'4" on a good day he was true Gracie and would fold me up in a matter of seconds. If I had to learn 1 form it would be Jiu-Jitsu as I feel it's the most practical for your everyday person #2 would be Krav Maga but feel this is more geared for law enforcement and military but extremely effective regardless. Remember everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth

Makes sense - all the way to your last sentence. Even those with the best plan are gonna get hit in the mouth (or elsewhere).

 

[Jackson]

You are being nice. Krav Maga is usually talked about in the same manner as Systema. With Derision by those in the know. That being said, I am sure there is some that is beneficial.

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Krav Maga was very good too. From my experience, it was an amalgam of wrestling, BJJ, boxing, Muay Tai, Tae Kwon Do, weapons use/defense, and "street fighting" (e.g. head butting, eye gouging, groin kicking, etc.). It really mixes many artforms and brings an intensity to fighting/surviving that you won't find with any other platform. My striking really improved through Krav Maga and opened my eyes on how you must meet aggression with MORE aggression.

I have no first hand experience with Krav, but from what I've seen it looks like what is described above. Its a mix of things pulled from different styles. That's fine, so long as the teacher is competent to teach it. It also requires other students proficient enough to really practice with. Its effectiveness will depend on the teacher and the training methods more than the name of the system.

It is unlikely you will ever become a proficient practitioner in any particular area if you learn a handful of techniques from a guy who is not an expert in those systems. Its very possible you will miss out on some of the important underlying principles the instructor doesn't understand or doesn't make time to convey.

It can also be an issue if you learn a set of techniques isolated from the larger system that makes them work. I can show you how to do an arm drag or a double leg takedown. We can drill it over and over. It probably won't impart the timing, sensitivity, and positional awareness required to make it work consistently against other wrestlers. Attempting to do it in live matches does that.

I like the concept of taking what you can use and fitting it in to the context of your likely problems. I think its best to have an underlying base of athleticism, timing, sensitivity, movement, etc that comes from competitive resistance to which you can add the extra stuff. Especially when that extra stuff is thetricky eye gouge or groin kick or whatever fight ending special move you've got. The guy with a good kickboxing base, great understanding of range, and developed timing will deliver both with more effect than if you learn the tricks first.

I take classes in JKD which is a mix of things and has all the same problems I described above. Some of it is great. Some is not. I try to be mindful of what I can fit in to the overall system and what is consistent with the more sporting things I can actually pull off with live resistance. Those are the things I can realistically use.

 

[Jackson]

I will also say that some of the Krav training methods where you do 4 moves against an almost static person and finish with 27 knees or punches to the head looks silly and would likely fall apart when tested with resistance. I have no idea whether that is the primary training method. I don't want to judge by that.

 

[Whitsettd8]

Makes sense - all the way to your last sentence. Even those with the best plan are gonna get hit in the mouth (or elsewhere).

It's a famous quote said by Mike Tyson leading up to his fight plan against Evander.

 

[OurDee]

Learn to use a cane. You may carry it when you can't carry anything else. I'm getting too old to fight.

 

[Jackson]

Learn to use a cane. You may carry it when you can't carry anything else. I'm getting too old to fight.

I asked this in the cane thread. Im really interested. What resources do you suggest for learning cane skills?

 

[Jackson]

I was thinking about this "if I had 6 months" statements...

If I had to fight to the death in 6 months my biggest priority would be strength and conditioning. The first rule of zombieland is cardio for a reason.


Its super important but the least fun for me. So I just go to class and do the martial arts. Its an area I'm seriously deficient.

 

[Ziggidy]

I have come to the conclusion that is I get into a fight I will either lie there in great pain or die right on the spot. There was a time, but that time is over.

 

[OurDee]

I asked this in the cane thread. Im really interested. What resources do you suggest for learning cane skills?

First watch videos on youtube. You should be able to figure out what you want to pursue from there. Give me a second; I'll see if I can find a sweet one...... The cane can be used in many disciplines. Here is an interesting one, I disagree when they say that to continue the attack after the guy is down makes you the aggressor. I'll be aggressive till the threat is eliminated.

 

[OurDee]

 

[Jackson]

Some of this is workable. I think some of it is probably crap. Its unlikely the average person would be able to apply any of it without actually practicing against real resistance.

Without real practice and testing, I believe the likely case for using a cane in this manner includes a couple of pokes or wide strikes that either thwarts the attack altogether or devolves in to a tug of war over the cane. Then the person with the stronger grip, more weight, and greater agility ragdolls the other person.

Not trying to crap on the cane idea. I think it can work. I think its unlikely a video like this gets you there without a solid base in other things

 

[hoosierfishing]

Anyone interested in stream lining empty hand self defense should check out Lee Morrison or Kelly McCann stuff. Unless you are wanting to dedicate a lot of your free time to traditional martial arts, then gross motor skill development rules the day imo. Learning how to properly kick the groin will go a lot farther then learning how to do a kimura or o-soto gari for the average person. Just my .02.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Some of this is workable. I think some of it is probably crap. Its unlikely the average person would be able to apply any of it without actually practicing against real resistance.

Without real practice and testing, I believe the likely case for using a cane in this manner includes a couple of pokes or wide strikes that either thwarts the attack altogether or devolves in to a tug of war over the cane. Then the person with the stronger grip, more weight, and greater agility ragdolls the other person.

Not trying to crap on the cane idea. I think it can work. I think its unlikely a video like this gets you there without a solid base in other things

Without pressure testing, you're getting maybe 1/4 of the value of anything IMO. Which is better than nothing. I did some cane work when I left the Army (as I was actually on a cane) and you can do some good work with a wooden cane with the 'shepherd crook' shape. My neighbor happened to be an instructor. I couldn't touch him with a chalk knife unless I was willing to risk significant injury. I think you can see some similarities with some BJJ/wrestling moves. Think of it like an extendable c-grip combined with the ability to deliver a strike. Arm drags, limb ties, etc work kind of the same.

What was more effective was ditching the knife, going for control of the cane, and then working entangled. That's the sort of thing just watching a video won't prepare you for, especially versus someone younger/faster/stronger even if they are just 'tard fighting.

 

[Denny347]

BJJ...hands down. But not all BJJ academies are not created equal, nor are their instructors. You will never stop learning and it is an incredible cardio workout. Many places have a Mui Thai or Dutch/American kickboxing programs. Do both. I train BJJ 6 days a week and have done so for the last 5 years. My standup is ok, mostly from work. What I have found is that BJJ is excellent at learning to control someone who doesn't want controlled. But where BJJ shines is the pressure. You roll with enough people better than you and you find yourself in terrible positions, many that induce panic. You will start to learn to think through that panic. THAT is the single largest asset I have gained from my 1600+ hrs of BJJ. It is that ability to think with your high brain while under stress that translates everyday life. Even more so than the actual moves. Even now, someone will get a nasty choke set, one that most people would quickly tap from. However, I have been finding that just when I thought I was about to go unconscious, I forced myself to relax. In relaxing, I was able to actually keep myself from passing out and worked on an escape plan. The forced relaxation in a situation where your instinct is to give up, is a great skill to practice. Not many martial arts allow that type of training. I also compete regularly, the best way I could find to test my training. Competitions are an entirely different mental animal. A tremendous amount of mental/physical preparation is required for each competition. I think I've done 6 this year. Throw a Gi on and try BJJ. It could change your life.

 

[gregkl]

BJJ sounds good but I think I may be past my window of starting something like that. At 62, kinda beat up but still healthy, I see a lot of injuries and slow recoveries from doing this type of training. I'd probably be paying for a program and missing a lot.

One of the owners of the gym I go to is a former Marine, boxer and purple belt(I believe) in BJJ. He's a good guy. I'll talk to him and see what he thinks. He teaches boxing at the gym. Maybe he would consider BJJ.

 

[Jackson]

BJJ sounds good but I think I may be past my window of starting something like that. At 62, kinda beat up but still healthy, I see a lot of injuries and slow recoveries from doing this type of training. I'd probably be paying for a program and missing a lot.

One of the owners of the gym I go to is a former Marine, boxer and purple belt(I believe) in BJJ. He's a good guy. I'll talk to him and see what he thinks. He teaches boxing at the gym. Maybe he would consider BJJ.

BJJ is scalable to any age or fitness level if you find the right school.

You can go 6 days a week and compete like Denny. You can go 2 or 3 days and rarely compete like me. You can go easy or hard. You can do 2 rounds in open mat or 10.

Just don't try to compare yourself to the younger, stronger guy who is there 6 days a week. That guy will get better faster and that can be discouraging. You only need to compare yourself to where you started.

 

[mark40sw]

Garrote​

 

[1gunaholic]

Garrote​

That's just a weapon. Not a discipline/sport that I'm aware of.