During unload and show clear.....

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  • Grelber

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    As a newb to shooting sports, I understand the question. I have thought that myself...but for different reasons. I don't like leaving live rounds on the ground because if someone steps on a round just right, I don't want it going off.

    Always surprised me that stomping live ammo into rocks does not cause problems at USPSA matches. Toward the end of a large match there might be 20-30 rounds or so spread about on a stage from folks clearing misfeeds (mainly pcc) and etc.. Young fast guys and old fat guys stomp all over them and I have never heard of one going off.
     

    Tanfodude

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    Always surprised me that stomping live ammo into rocks does not cause problems at USPSA matches. Toward the end of a large match there might be 20-30 rounds or so spread about on a stage from folks clearing misfeeds (mainly pcc) and etc.. Young fast guys and old fat guys stomp all over them and I have never heard of one going off.

    Yet, they fear that getting that last round out will detonate on their hand hence they just eject it and leave. I guess Ben Stoeger's hand will be blown up any time by now (and still waiting).
     

    rvb

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    Yet, they fear that getting that last round out will detonate on their hand hence they just eject it and leave. I guess Ben Stoeger's hand will be blown up any time by now (and still waiting).

    Do you think it doesn’t happen? Seems often the culprit is a long ejector 2011 (9mm or 40) (and likely w. a weak extractor). Im sure some gun designs make it more or less likely. I’ve seen the aftermath a couple times. Like I said above, not a fan of the hand over ejection port and dribbling the round out. Everyone can do what they want, I’ll just be a step or two farther back...

    -rvb
     

    Bosshoss

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    Always surprised me that stomping live ammo into rocks does not cause problems at USPSA matches. Toward the end of a large match there might be 20-30 rounds or so spread about on a stage from folks clearing misfeeds (mainly pcc) and etc.. Young fast guys and old fat guys stomp all over them and I have never heard of one going off.

    Kinda different but the same. Two of us was doing setup for this years SNS match and we were moving some walls left from the PCC match a couple of weeks before.
    I was swinging a pickax trying to get it under the wall stand to pry up the stake when I hit a live round that was hiding under the wall stand with the pickax. Round went off and bullet landed over by the other guy about 10 feet away. Threw a few rocks around but just scared the crap out of me and was LOUD.

    I also know two revolver shooters that have had rounds go off when they dropped a partially loaded moonclip on gravel and they landed on the primer.

    Not sure what any of this has to do with OP but rounds on the ground can be interesting.
     

    rhino

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    Yet, they fear that getting that last round out will detonate on their hand hence they just eject it and leave. I guess Ben Stoeger's hand will be blown up any time by now (and still waiting).

    I know two people who have sustained ".40 hand" while unloading their Limited gun. For the first, I was there and it was scary. The second I learned about via confession after the fact. Feel free to doubt it happens, but having been there and seen it, I do not doubt it.
     

    Tanfodude

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    I know two people who have sustained ".40 hand" while unloading their Limited gun. For the first, I was there and it was scary. The second I learned about via confession after the fact. Feel free to doubt it happens, but having been there and seen it, I do not doubt it.

    Ok, for the sake of discussion. Those people who had their ammo explode, did they eject their round the proper way? Mechanically, an ejected round shouldn't detonate, unless ejected the wrong way. (recoil spring too strong the slide returned too early and caugt the but of the ammo and hit the primer in a weird angle) Or if it was handloaded, they loaded it in a way where the primer is way too deep and really sensitive to any rear pounding or an overloaded/overcharged or very undercharged (someone has a theory about the latter).

    And if that is really the case, where, it'll just randomly explode, it would have been prevalent over the years of incidents like that happening. Yes, I'm not discounting it happens but when it did, it has to be an operator error, whether through the process of ejecting the round or how the round was reloaded. But is common not to admit that it is human error when it occurs.
     
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    Trapper Jim

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    Ok, for the sake of discussion. Those people who had their ammo explode, did they eject their round the proper way? Mechanically, an ejected round shouldn't detonate, unless ejected the wrong way. (recoil spring too strong the slide returned too early and caugt the but of the ammo and hit the primer in a weird angle) Or if it was handloaded, they loaded it in a way where the primer is way too deep and really sensitive to any rear pounding.

    And if that is really the case, where, it'll just randomly explode, it would have been prevalent over the years of incidents like that happening. Yes, I'm not discounting it happens but when it did, it has to be an operator error, whether through the process of ejecting the round or how the round was reloaded. But is common not to admit that it is human error when it occurs.

    just curious how you feel about hangfires or maybe they don’t happen either:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:
     

    Tanfodude

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    just curious how you feel about hangfires or maybe they don’t happen either:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

    That sure is likely more to occure as the primer has already been struck, so yeah, really dumb if someone picks that up that round didn't go off (lightstrike). And that round will be ejected for sure, on ground. :): So now we have to worry about round as it may detonate a day later.

    Still irrelevant to a round during ULSC.
     
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    rvb

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    weak extractor, no magazine so no round under the chambered round as it is pulled out. it slips down a little as the nose starts to cam out and ejector hits primer. even if extractor tension is good if you're doing it easy and for some reason it doesn't all happen in one smooth motion and the round doesn't eject all the way the slide partially closing can cause extractor or corner of slide to hit primer. It's not unheard of. you can go search enos and find great smiths like benny hill discussing this. sometimes it's a gun that needs some maintenance, sometimes the way it's handled, some times a little of both. As I said, the instances I'm aware of were 9 or 40 19/2011s. For guns designed around a 9mm like the cz/tangfo, probably the odds are a lot lower of it happening. Still prefer not to have my hand over or face near the port.

    -rvb
     

    Cameramonkey

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    I look down. If I see more than one 9mm Flat point I pick them both up and dispose of them so I dont leave live rounds on the ground. If I see only one its obviously mine. :p
     

    rhino

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    weak extractor, no magazine so no round under the chambered round as it is pulled out. it slips down a little as the nose starts to cam out and ejector hits primer. even if extractor tension is good if you're doing it easy and for some reason it doesn't all happen in one smooth motion and the round doesn't eject all the way the slide partially closing can cause extractor or corner of slide to hit primer. It's not unheard of. you can go search enos and find great smiths like benny hill discussing this. sometimes it's a gun that needs some maintenance, sometimes the way it's handled, some times a little of both. As I said, the instances I'm aware of were 9 or 40 19/2011s. For guns designed around a 9mm like the cz/tangfo, probably the odds are a lot lower of it happening. Still prefer not to have my hand over or face near the port.

    -rvb

    That's the takeaway. Don't cover the ejection port with your hand and don't have your face near the ejection port when unloading. That significantly reduces the chance of injury.
     

    Grelber

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    Ok, for the sake of discussion. Those people who had their ammo explode, did they eject their round the proper way? Mechanically, an ejected round shouldn't detonate, unless ejected the wrong way. (recoil spring too strong the slide returned too early and caugt the but of the ammo and hit the primer in a weird angle) Or if it was handloaded, they loaded it in a way where the primer is way too deep and really sensitive to any rear pounding or an overloaded/overcharged or very undercharged (someone has a theory about the latter).

    And if that is really the case, where, it'll just randomly explode, it would have been prevalent over the years of incidents like that happening. Yes, I'm not discounting it happens but when it did, it has to be an operator error, whether through the process of ejecting the round or how the round was reloaded. But is common not to admit that it is human error when it occurs.

    Sometimes it is little ants. They are attracted to gunpowder but go dormant inside loaded brass. When they feel the abrupt movement during unload and show clear they can startle and sometimes ignite the powder. This is where the term "fire ants" originated. Most people don't know this.
     

    gregkl

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    Sometimes it is little ants. They are attracted to gunpowder but go dormant inside loaded brass. When they feel the abrupt movement during unload and show clear they can startle and sometimes ignite the powder. This is where the term "fire ants" originated. Most people don't know this.

    lol. Rep inbound!:)
     

    Coach

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    Sometimes it is little ants. They are attracted to gunpowder but go dormant inside loaded brass. When they feel the abrupt movement during unload and show clear they can startle and sometimes ignite the powder. This is where the term "fire ants" originated. Most people don't know this.

    What about **** ants?
     

    Twangbanger

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    Why is it that most people just drop that ammo on the ground and not pick it back up? If you do that for every local match, you just wasted 6 ammo. If going to local matches 3-4 times, that's 18-24 ammo wasted per month. That's a full mag of ammo thrown away. I see this all the time. Makes me cringe.

    So my question is, why waste that much ammo?

    Hap, your thriftiness and practicality has an almost eastern quality to it, and is appreciated. :yesway:

    You must remember America was founded by people dedicated to an unattainable ideal of ethical perfection. So we have what are called "Pistol Puritans." (Not to be confused with Luddite Curmudgeons, which I gather are something different...). (Note: this puritanical behavior does not extend to saving ammo, as when thriftiness conflicts with calling attention to oneself through acrobatic displays, modesty is the higher virtue).

    How to recognize a Pistol Puritan: you may have been at Zone 5 SS/Prod/Revolver championship at ACC a few years back, where the one RO in back was giving the sergeant drill about "You must begin facing directly down range - that means not just your feet, your hips, your shoulders, your head, everything...if I say standby, and your head turns to the targets before the buzzer sounds, I will gouge out your eyeballs, make you re-start the stage and the rest of the squad has to do pushups..."

    Ok, that's a Pistol Puritan.

    How to deal with Pistol Puritans in the wild:

    1) As you surmised, it is important you eject the round and catch it. Usually in your hand, preferably in your teeth as mentioned above. Pro Points if you study it closely...then toss it on the ground anyway.

    2) Remark loudly how pleased you are that you caught your "bullet." (It is important to refer to it as a "bullet," not a cartridge).

    3) While picking up your magazines, loudly refer to them as "clips."

    These displays provide the Pistol Puritan opportunities to build character in the face of adversity (a Puritan virtue).

    Your normally-scheduled cabin fever may now resume...:drill:
     
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